March 23, 2012

PZ Myers' Animal Sex: A Big Question For PZ

I enjoy photos of nature and animals as much as the next person. But I find it a bit odd when people have a continuous obsession with animal sex. The fact is, bestiality is on the rise today and the most popular atheist blog on the Internet seems to be supportive of this trend. PZ Myers is the militant atheist who founded the top atheist blog Pharyngula and, guess what, you generally won't find logical arguments supporting atheism there, but, rather, you will find a steady stream of blasphemy, religious ridicule and a weekly animal sex post entitled "Friday Cephalopod." Based on his outspoken support for his daughter's views on the subject, it seems PZ Myers may not be opposed to bestiality. And I have a question for him related to this subject, if he would be so kind as to answer it. That is, whether or not bestiality is morally justifiable in his view - why or why not.

What launched PZ Myers' blog into the stratosphere was a controversial post in which he documented his desecration of a Koran, a Catholic communion wafer and some other items. The summation of this arrogant but impotent act was Myer's claim that "Nothing must be held sacred."[1] Ironically, PZ Myers' actions and blog are a great big object lesson underscoring the truth of the sacred scriptures. The biblical view on bestiality is quite clear. Perhaps when Myers offers his views on bestiality, then there will be an opportunity for a logical critique of his views.


I. Bestiality is on the rise
II. PZ Myers is apparently not opposed to bestiality
III. Animal sex is a continuous attraction at PZ Myers' blog
IV. PZ Myers is reluctant to plainly state his opinion on bestialiy
V. How PZ Myers helps to confirm the truth of scripture

In case you aren't aware, bestiality, also known as zoophilia, is now considered legitimate behavior in the US military, although it is apparently outlawed by all US states. As of January 1, 2012 (the signing of the NDAA), US soldiers may engage in sexual intercourse with animals if they so desire.[2]

Denmark, Norway and Sweden legally permit bestiality, and, incidentally, these countries rank highest in atheistic and evolutionary belief. These countries sport "animal brothels" and this is catching on in Europe.[3] On February 3, 2012, Germany's English news 'The local' described how animal brothels are popping up across Germany. An  animal protection official, Madeleine Martin, stated, "'It is punishable to distribute animal pornography, but the act itself is not,' and "'There are even animal brothels in Germany,' she said. Sex with animals was being increasingly seen as a lifestyle choice, and thus more acceptable."[4] According to theism, sex with animals is considered unhealthy and morally unacceptable. Philip Parham's best-seller Letting God offers practical insight on recovering from unhealthy sexual addictions and it has received stellar ratings.

II. PZ Myers is apparently not opposed to bestiality

In 2008, PZ Myers stood up for his daughter Skatje Myers, who was quoted as supporting bestiality. Myer's did not denounce his daughters opinion, but, rather, was incensed that someone would dare to present his daughter's opinion to a wider audience. Myers erroneously labelled the exposure "quote mining" as noted, "Quote-mining (badly) my daughter isn't just ugly, it's vile and loathsome and despicable."[5] Quote mining is defined as quoting someone out of context in order to distort the meaning of the original text. In comparing the brief quote excerpted by Salvador Cordova with the full original text, there does not seem to be any distortion of meaning. Skatje's original text includes even more bizarre details. This is Cordova's excerpt:

"Sexual relationships between humans and animals come as such a shock to people, but it doesn’t to me. There can be very deep, meaningful relationships between humans and their pets." Skatje Myers (daughter of Darwinist PZ Myers)

The full text by Skatje Myers may be seen at comment #35 at the aforementioned blog post.[6] In the full context of the text, Skatje implies she is for the legalization of bestiality: "I don't support it being legal because I want to hump animals. You might ask, why even bother arguing for this position if it really doesn't actually matter to me." and then she addresses what she considers the 2 main objections to bestiality. According to Skatje, sex with animals is not necessarily abusive:: "Animals can approach humans for sexual reasons too. Ever owned a dog? They'll come right up to you and start poking at your crotch." According to Ms. Myers, sex with animals can be consensual

"Animals understand what sex is and they CAN communicate it. Not in words, of course, but in action."  Skatje clarifies why she personally does not practice bestiality: "That said, I remind you that my position isn't based on my own personal wants. I just don't see any reason to ban it other than the same reason things like homosexuality and sodomy were banned: it's icky. I think it's bad practice to put social taboos into legislature when no actual logical argument can be made against it."[7]

Even if you allow the possibility that 'consensual sex' between humans and animals exists, this point is not a moral foundation and Skatje's rationale isn't very convincing. Skatje does not address the deeper aspect of human exceptionalism. If there is no human exceptionalism then human cannibalism would be acceptable as well, just as fish eating other fish is considered perfectly natural. Not only is bestiality unnatural, statistics show it isn't so great for health and society. Research shows that bestiality causes penile cancer[8] and those who practice it are more likely to commit violence and sex crimes.[9] These statistics offer evidence that morality has an objective basis, confirming the maxim that sin isn't bad because it's forbidden, it's forbidden because it's bad.

While vehemently defending his daughters views on bestiality, PZ Myers had an opportunity to clarify his personal views on the subject, but he chose not to. If he wants to draw criticism away from his daughter, then why can't he 'be a man' and clearly outline his own views on the subject? It's anyone's guess what views Skatje Myers holds on this subject today because she's already made one major flip-flop on this issue She went from this opinion: "I don't support it being legal because I want to hump animals." To this one, "I do not support bestiality." - as noted in a comment posted January 2, 2008 at PZ Myers' blog.[10]

At best, PZ Myers is displaying cowardliness and uncertainty in not volunteering his specific views on bestiality. At worst, he may be an addicted zoophile. The late Christopoher Hitchens was confronted with this subject in 2009 and was not quite sure how to answer. Hitchens was asked in a Q-and-A-session after a debate to state whether he believed it was "good" or "morally repressive" that the Bible forbade zoophilia. Hitchens refused to answer the question the first time and again the second time the question was posed.[11]  Bestiality is a big question today, and a question atheist apologists don't seem to want to touch.

III.  Animal sex is a continuous attraction at PZ Myer's blog

Every week, PZ Myers' "Friday Cephalopod" celebrates some aspects of animal sex, usually between  octopi or squids. A recent addition was, "the Cephalopod Kama Sutra is an amazing book"[12] This trend seems to have begun when PZ described a case of a man in England who was charged with animal pornography. Apparently, bestiality photos were the central theme. PZ described a man "possessing "an 'extreme pornographic' image of someone having sex with a dead octopus or squid." PZ offered, "Erotic art with cephalopods has a long history...I'd also recommend looking up the work of Hokusai, Teraoka, or Saeki (but not if you live in England! That could land you in jail)."[13] PZ Myers' animal sex posts range from the sophomoric to the sick. In one edition, "French cephalopod porn" PZ states, "This movie of mating octopuses is beautiful…but the narrator speaks in this husky French voice that makes it sound horribly lewd, like a dirty old man. Even better!"[14] Another "Friday Cephalopod" states "NUMBERLESS HOSTS!", "Friday Cephalopod: Flowers? Or porn?" And so it continues.

IV. PZ Myers is reluctant to plainly state his opinion on bestiality

Though he has vehemently defended his daughter's right to defend legalized bestiality, PZ Myers is reluctant to plainly state his opinion whether bestiality is moral or not. And, as far as I know, PZ Myers has never stated explicitly why he publishes a weekly animal sex post. But when you consider that Myers has the most popular atheist blog, this implies that his readers do actually enjoy his weekly animal sex themes. PZ Myers has been unwilling to volunteer and clarify his own views on bestiality, so all the we have to go on from his blog is his daughter's elaborate description of the subject.

V. How PZ Myers helps to confirm the truth of scripture

PZ Myers confirms the truth of scripture in a number of ways. For one thing, it is a sign of the times. In Matthew 24.7, Jesus is quoted as saying, "As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man."(NIV). Here's one aspect of that time, outlined in Genesis 6.5, "The LORD saw how great man's wickedness on the earth had become, and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil all the time."{NIV) Bestiality isn't just "icky", it's evil, an abomination against God and nature. This was one of the popular practices of the Canaanites. Revered and popular humanist professors may believe they are avaunt-guard, but there is nothing new about perversion and decadence. PZ confirms the scriptures in other ways as well.

When knowledgeable jewelers present a diamond for sale they will usually present them on black velvet so that the brilliance of the diamonds are more clearly seen by the contrast. Likewise, when atheists such as PZ Myers become engrossed with things such as blaspheming, sacrilege and animal erotica, they aren't really doing any harm to the truth of God's word, rather, they are helping to confirm its truth. Romans 1.25 states,

"They exchanged the truth about God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—" In refusing to acknowledge and worship the true and living God, men will eventually begin to worship idols, whatever they may be, including pleasure, animals and animal sex.

The more deliberately a person's attempts are to reject the truth of God's existence, the more bizarre and self destructive the behavior will become. This is because morality does in fact have an objective basis. Skatje Myers was quite wrong in her statement about bestiality, " actual logical argument can be made against it." The fact that logic itself works, that mathematics works universally, that the material universe includes a vast hierarchical system all point to the fact that objective truth and morality exist and they oppose the practice of bestiality.[15] As Western Civilizations sinks lower and lower into the dark depths of atheistic postmodern relativism, it's not surprising to note that the behavior of people is becoming more uncontrolled and bizarre. On a field trip to Ken Ham's Creation museum, PZ Myers told his class,

"Remember, if you are calm, civil, and well-behaved, and you tour the "museum", we win. If you are calm, civil, and well-behaved, and the security guards throw you out because they don't like the fact that you're an atheist, we win. If you are angry, rude, and cause trouble that gives them a reasonable excuse to throw you out, we lose, and I will be very pissed off at you."[16]

Sorry, PZ, but you are wrong. The fact that you need to threaten your college students in order for them to be civil and not act like animals shows that you, and secular humanism, have lost. Society under the tightly-held atheist hegemony of ideas in public education has lost. It has only become more lawless and violent. The fact that your blog focuses more on animal sex than on logical science only serves to underscore how people today are more willing to trade reason and logic for beastly instinct, just as Jude 1.10 outlines:

"Yet these men speak abusively against whatever they do not understand; and what things they do understand by instinct, like unreasoning animals--these are the very things that destroy them."(NIV). As society sinks down lower, Christianity rises to the top and continues to grow. As the late Hugh E. Brown observed, "Christianity is not being destroyed by the confusions and concussions of the time; it is being discovered."

PZ, if you would be so kind, would you be willing to answer the following question, "If you believe the Bible is wrong in forbidding bestiality, can you provide a logical basis for morally justifying it?"


[1] Pharyngula, The Great Desecration,
[2]  Information Liberation, The Real Problem with the National Defense Authorization Act,
[3] Conservapedia, Evolutionary belief and bestiality,
[4] The Local, Bestiality brothels spur call for animal sex ban  -  Published: 3 Feb 12 16:54 CET  -
[5] Pharyngula, Just when you think Slimy Sal couldn't sink any lower…,
[6] Ibid. - Comment #35 (FtK | January 2, 2008 7:25 PM)
[7] Ibid. - Comment #35 (FtK | January 2, 2008 7:25 PM)
[8] Live Science, Sex With Animals Linked to Penile Cancer,
[9] Brantley (1998), Lockwood and Ascione (1998) outline bestialty and violence connection.
Hensley and Tallichet (2009) outline how 1 in 5 violent offenders had had sex with animals),
[10] Pharyngula, Skatje Myers' blog comment, (January 2, 2008 8:08 PM),
[11] YouTube, Christopher Hitchens vs William Lane Craig - Does God Exist Debate, Biola (2009-04-04) (1.54 mark, 2 questions)
[12] Pharyngula, Friday Cephalopod, the Cephalopod Kama Sutra is an amazing book (March 9, 2012 11:07 AM, by PZ Myers),
[13] Pharyngula, Do not have sex with the cephalopods!
[14] Pharyngula,, French cephalopod porn,
[15] Templestream, The Nature of Truth, The Nature of Truth as a Logical Proof of God's Existence,
[16] Pharyngula, The Creation "Museum" has given us warning

Image thumb from Barking Moonbat website 

Tags: PZ Myers and bestiality, PZ Myers' squids, US military approves bestiality, bestiality in armed services, is bestiality immoral?, morality and human exceptionalism, signs of the last days, big animal sex blog, animal intercourse, zoophilia photos, bestiality photos, bestiality sex, research shows bestiality causes penile cancer, bestiality linked to violence, evidence of objective morality, sex with animals, sexual intercourse with animals, animal brothels now open in Germany

(article revised 05/17/12)

Note: Two comments were posted at PZ's blog March 24 and a challenge to answer my question for him regarding bestiality, linked here. Apparently, PZ's blogger's don't agree with PZ's daughter:

"Animals cannot consent, because they do not understand what human sexuality is, nor are they capable of understanding potential consequences of sexual contact with a human." (24 March 2012 at 1:04 pm)

"Bestiality is the rape of animals by humans, plain and simple. If you support that, you are supporting a form of rape." (24 March 2012 at 1:50 pm)

PZ himself sidestepped my questions and offered a vague, unspecific response, as noted in this article, linked.


An Open Letter to PZ and Skatje Myers


  1. News Flash

    There is contention and confusion in the atheist camp. PZ's blogger's don't agree with PZ's daughter. They believe bestiality is immoral:

    "Animals cannot consent, because they do not understand what human sexuality is, nor are they capable of understanding potential consequences of sexual contact with a human." (24 March 2012 at 1:04 pm)

    "Bestiality is the rape of animals by humans, plain and simple. If you support that, you are supporting a form of rape." (24 March 2012 at 1:50 pm)

    - So what say ye, PZ? Is bestiality moral or not? Be a man and not a squid. Make a decision and support your decision with logic. We're waiting.

    1. not everyone in a group has to agree for there to be peace, sir. also, you seem to be perseverating quite a bit on bestiality. i do the same thing with swords and classical dance, however, i do that because i have a long held interest in those things with lots and lots of practice. why do you perseverate on bestiality? why do you have those pictures of sheep in stockings?

  2. No, it's just you, Rick.

    Just you.

    1. PZ Myer's daughter supports legalized bestiality.

      PZ's bloggers call it basically animal rape.

      And PZ remains mum on the subject.

      In what way does that equal, "It's just you"?

      A bit of a non-sequitur, Anonymous.

      There's no lack of commentary on the Internet regarding this subject:

      "So, it's more than a little amusing to see PZ Myers angrily defending his daughter's public argument against anti-bestiality laws. Now, it's certainly the girl's right to advocate on behalf of whatever legal cause she feels is important to her, but this particular choice of subject really doesn't provide the most convincing evidence against the oft-repeated charge that atheists are hopelessly immoral. And if there's nothing rationally objectionable about the practice, then from whence comes this defensive paternal outrage?"

      Vox Day -

      Poster Comment: Watch out for for your ferrets, cats and dogs if an atheist is around.

    2. It's "just you", as in, it's just you that's waiting. A little clearer now?

      In case it wasn't obvious, PZ Myers is in no way obligated to answer your question.

      BTW, thanks for changing all "Meyers" to "Myers". It's nice to see that you actually can fix your mistakes :)

    3. >In case it wasn't obvious, PZ Myers is in no way obligated to answer your question.

      - If Myers cannot explain the basis of his own morality, he probably shouldn't be telling the world what we "must" believe. :-)

      "Nothing must be held sacred." Yeah, right, PZ.

      BTW - Spelling mistakes can be easily corrected, but sin isn't quite the same. There's only been one cure offered in all of history:

  3. Oh goody - the old, tired, thoroughly debunked "atheists have no basis for morality!" argument.

    At best, you can only say that atheists have no basis for objective morality, which doesn't really help you, considering that Christians have no basis for objective morality either - especially dispensionalists, who mantain that in different eras God relates to human beings in different ways under different Biblical covenants.

    In other words, what was allowed 100-200 years ago is not allowed anymore. Doesn't look very objective to me :)

    And correcting sin is very easy:
    - step one: recognize that sin is a artificial human construct which has no relevance to reality we live in.

    That's it.


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